Prof Casey says antidepressants do not cause suicide; the FDA and the EMA are lying then?

I have a little problem. I love my country (Ireland) but have to admit that we Irish have a tendancy to accept our fate, no matter what. Corrupt policitions, the Catholic Church and our ‘key opinion leaders’ have been allowed to cause havoc on our lovely Emerald Isle for centuries. My main issue is our ‘leading’ psychiatrists who have and still are denying that antidepressants can cause suicide, despite the regulators and drug companies having to admit that they do.

I have already published a video where UCD psychiatrist Patricia Casey denies that antidepressants can cause suicide. As you know she has already sent me two solicitors letters (one and two) so here’s my problem; do I stop writing about what I believe in, that these drugs are killing people or do I say “póg mo thóin” and keep trying to warn the unsuspecting public? She certainly is not on her own and it seems that the College of Psychiatry of Ireland collectively believe that these drugs do not cause suicide. This is wrong on so many levels.

The EMA have warned that these drugs can increase the risk of suicide in under 25’s. The FDA added a black-box warning to all antidepressants because of the increased risk of suicide and yet our Irish psychiatrists continue to oppose the medicines regulators. This has got to stop. People are dying because of their ‘failure to warn’. Prof Casey was present at Shane’s Inquest and also another mans, who were both (co-incidentally or not) taking Lundbeck’s drug. She sure does a lot of work for Lundbeck.

AC: Do you believe that citalopram can cause somebody who would not otherwise take their own life to do so?

CM (Lundbeck Doctor): Yes. http://davidhealy.org/model-doctors

póg mo thóin: Irish for “kiss my ass”.

https://leoniefennell.wordpress.com/2011/07/04/something-is-rotten-in-irish-psychiatry/

https://leoniefennell.wordpress.com/2011/10/02/was-this-a-campaign-of-intimidation-from-the-irish-college-of-psychiatry/


15 thoughts on “Prof Casey says antidepressants do not cause suicide; the FDA and the EMA are lying then?

    1. Dear Leonie
      You have a clear definition what you are writing about, and why knowledge is power. Don’t give others the power to control your goals through implicit or explicit; you have lost your son…you must concentrate on winning your own self-approval scheduling your time, setting and achieving your own goals.The basic issue in life is whether we will be open to others, at least to the extent of respect fairness.You are very courageous.
      Cornerstone of civility
      Psychiatrist, they are only ordinary humans.The only become civil through development and learning.This is true for any profession organisation.Many factors can either read or enhance such development and learning.The most mysterious of these factors is free will.Anyone deeply dedicated to love,light,and truth will be civil indeed, no matter what her formal belief system or lack of it is.Kind regards N Kelly

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  1. hmmm….

    The EMA seems to disagree…

    “A meta-analysis of placebo-controlled clinical trials of antidepressant drugs in adult patients with psychiatric disorders showed an increased risk of suicidal behaviour with antidepressants compared to placebo in patients less than 25 years old”.. (EMA)

    As do many hundreds of thousands of ex-anti-depressant users. (Yes , I am one of them unfortunately).

    Anti-depressants don’t cause suicide in everybody, but they do in some cases. Yes, depression has a risk of suicide, we know that, but so does chemically treated depression. To state that anti-depressants do not cause suicide is quite definitive. It excludes any possibility or risk whatsoever. It is impossible to be so definitive and absolute given the nature of SSRI side effects, individual body chemistry, and the vulnerable state that those prescribed an SSRI are usually experiencing. No genuine scientist would ever state such a definitive claim in regards to any chemical substance digested in the body. It is simply incredulous to have such an utterly definitive opinion on SSRI’s and suicides. That’s why the drug companies and the regulators admit that it’s a possibility. It is astounding and disturbing how Irish psychiatry continue to deny the elephant in the room which everyone else has accepted is there. The fact that a black and white opinion on SSRI suicides would be so resoundingly resolute, conclusive, and continually and categorically stated by Irish psychiatry, speaks volumes..

    Denial does not an argument make…

    Personally, I think Irish psychiatry has a lot of explaining to do…
    The more they dig that hole, the more ridiculous they look..
    I suppose, they feel they can’t backtrack now can they?

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  2. The problem with mainstream psychiatric opinion is one of ideology. They cannot backtrack on their definitive statements on SSRI’s and Suicide because that would undermine their professional ideology, therefore the name of the game now is to close ranks and keep on denying. The irony is, as psychiatry does that, the rest of the world has already accepted the risks of SSRI’s, and it moves on. Therefore, the ‘denial agenda’ itself is beginning to undermine psychiatry completely. I’m sure that this irony would not be lost on the many many people whom have been harmed by psychiatric drugs. Saying that anti-depressants do not have high risks is like saying that tobacco doesn’t cause cancer. It’s completely outdated. Psychiatry needs not only to wake up, it also needs to start telling the public the truth. People just don’t buy the dogma anymore.

    http://jenniferhros.wordpress.com/2012/03/09/anti-depressants-psychiatry-needs-to-wake-up/

    ANTI-DEPRESSANTS: PSYCHIATRY NEEDS TO WAKE UP

    Posted by Jenniferhros on March 9, 2012 ·
    On Monday I reported for the Irish Examiner on comments made by Dr Declan Gilsenan, a former deputy state pathologist, who highlighted his concerns about a link between SSRI anti-depressants and suicide. In a nutshell Dr Gilsenan said he had seen too many cases where people who had taken their own lives had recently begun taking SSRI anti-depressants.
    He also referred to a high profile case in recent years in this country, on which he worked, and was concerned about due to toxicology reports he carried out. I won’t go into the details of the case again, as needless to say I have already been accused of using a family’s grief for a story and don’t want that to happen again.
    What I am interested in is the bigger picture. People like Dr Terry Lynch, Dr Gilsenan and others are speaking out on an important issue, but unfortunately their voices are drowned in a sea of opposition from mainstream psychiatry.
    Worryingly, the people that often get the most air time in this country are those who continue to deny that legally prescribed drugs can be harmful.
    On RTE radio on Monday at the end of a debate on autism, Pat Kenny’s resident psychiatrist Prof Jim Lucey said Dr Gilsenan’s views were “a classic example of a single dimemsional divide” that occurs in the suicide debate. Not sure exactly what that means, but he went on to say there is “no evidence” that anti-depressants cause suicide, and referred to an “anti-psychiatry movement”. Prof Lucey instead preferred to blame alcohol for a rise in suicide. I was under the impression that we Irish had always drunk copious amounts, so why all of a sudden is it driving us to suicide? Perhaps the issue of alcohol mixed with legally prescribed drugs would be a more valid argument. Coroners up and down the country have been commenting on the number of cases where legally prescribed drugs are a factor in deaths.
    After a RTE Frontline debate on mental health earlier this year, psychiatrist Prof Patricia Casey wrote an inflammatory piece for the Irish Independent saying the programme could “cost lives”.
    Minister Kathleen Lynch had bravely spoken out saying she believed depression medication was only for short-term use
    According to Prof Casey: “What was most worrying was the suggestion that if only we had enough talking therapies the problem of depression would be reduced and so too would suicide.”
    Psychiatry needs to wake up. It has a dark history, and comments like this serve only to highlight how out of touch some of its disciples are.
    Speaking to people like the inspirational Joan Freeman of Pieta House, and Dr Terry Lynch, they believe that’s exactly what people need – to talk. Some will need medication too of course, but therapy needs to the biggest part of their recovery. Robert Whitaker was in Ireland last year, and his book, Mad in America should be read by every psychiatrist to remind them just where their profession originated.
    A quick look at http://ssristories.com or the blog by Prof David Healy http://davidhealy.org reveals the extent of the problem.
    Prof Healy, who is Irish but based in the UK, has been involved as an expert witness in homicide and suicide trials involving psychotropic drugs, and in bringing problems with these drugs to the attention of American and British regulators, as well raising awareness of how pharmaceutical companies sell drugs by marketing diseases and co-opting academic opinion-leaders, ghost-writing their articles.
    It was heartening to hear Minister Kathleen Lynch congratulating Dr Gilsenan for speaking out, and to see others coming out in support of him.
    Psychiatry needs to wake up to the dangers of the drugs they are prescribing.
    Professionals in this area really need to be more proactive in warning people about dangers. Yes extreme side effects only happen in a small minority of people but they still happen and can cause great harm.
    Even the pharmaceutical companies who make them recognise the dangers.
    What I and many others am interested in is the bigger picture, which as an editorial in the Examiner pointed out, surely can no longer be ignored.

    Other stories of interest:
    http://www.examiner.ie/ireland/deaths-linked-to-methadone-and-anti-depressants-soar-144336.html
    http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/5m-drug-prescriptions-for-mental-health-a-year-163317.html
    http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/health/drugs-overload-163299.html
    http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/kfeyidkfgbey/rss2/

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  3. http://truthman30.wordpress.com/2012/03/16/ssri-suicide-the-causation-conundrum/

    causation |kôˈzā sh ən|
    noun

    the action of causing something : investigating the role of nitrate in the causation of cancer.
    • the relationship between cause and effect; causality.

    A very close friend of mine is writing her final year thesis on the language that psychiatry uses in order to confuse and obscure the fact that it is an entirely redundant pseudo-belief system which is of no use whatsoever in the treatment of mental health problems. She is writing this thesis through the lens of English critical theory. Critical theory deconstructs and analyses the syntax, terminologies and definitions of words and language. It makes a kind of order out of language. Psychiatry uses language as a weapon and my friend’s thesis aims to examine and explore how it does this. I can’t wait to read her final draft.

    One very interesting thing that she intends to scrutinize is this idea of ‘causation’ when it comes to SSRI suicides. Psychiatry and the drug companies claim that there is no way to prove ‘causation’ in a suspected case of SSRI induced suicide . This is indeed quite true, because, if an individual successfully completes a suicide from an SSRI, it is impossible to determine if it was the individual ‘illness’ of mind which led them to successful suicide or the effects of the drug. Depression and other emotional disorders have a risk of suicide, so psychiatry and drug companies can easily manipulate this fact to their favor and they can then dismiss every SSRI suicide down to the individual’s prior mental state.

    Basically, to prove causation, an individual would have to kill themselves twice (which is of course entirely impossible). To prove (or to successfully make a claim) that an SSRI causes suicide, an individual would have to firstly kill themselves whilst on an SSRI, then kill themselves again whilst taking an SSRI again. It is because of this conundrum that Psychiatry and the drug companies can easily defend SSRI’s and constantly re-assert that ‘causation’ cannot be determined. When people hear this type of language , ‘causation cannot be determined’, they immediately think in scientific terms, and even the layperson goes along with the jargon, because it sounds convincing to the ear. It sounds plausible because the language employed sounds definitive. But, what it disguises is, the method and theory which could prove causation is mortally and scientifically impossible to enact, therefore what psychiatry should really say is, ‘causation cannot be proven but neither can it be disproven’ because the methodology is scientifically unsound. This would be a far more accurate conclusion. It is all the more sinister when you consider that it is impossible to prove nor disprove ‘causation’ when it comes to SSRI completed suicides. When someone is dead, they can’t come back and complain about side effects can they? It is disturbing when death becomes a way of protecting an ideology. But it seems that psychiatry is quite content in trading and profiting on this gruesome premise.

    But there is a way through this…

    How about testing SSRI’s on people who are not depressed, not mentally ill and not emotionally disturbed. In other words, how about seeing what their effects are on ‘healthy volunteers’?

    Dr David Healy has seen studies that GSK have done with Seroxat on healthy volunteers. These studies are under seal in the Glaxo archives and some of the results are very disturbing. If GSK was an ethical company it would release these studies to the general public, but it seems that it is close to impossible to get access to them. The Seroxat conundrum could easily be solved, but the only way to do that would be through the courts. GSK cannot be allowed to get away with the Seroxat Scandal. Too many people have been damaged, and hurt. This is a human rights issue above and beyond its legal implications. Let’s hope 2012 is the year of Justice. Read on :

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/panorama/2317751.stm

    As part of my background research for this case, I had been given access to GlaxoSmithKline’s Seroxat healthy volunteer archive. This involved being brought into a room with several hundred thousand pages of data from healthy volunteer trials.

    The reason to chase these files was that it had shortly before become clear to me from a study conducted in north Wales on healthy volunteers taking sertraline, another SSRI, and from looking through the healthy volunteer archives held by Pfizer on sertraline, that SSRIs could trigger suicidality in even healthy volunteers.

    Access to GlaxoSmithKline’s archive in Harlow had only been granted, as far as I know, essentially a week before my final report in the case was due to be submitted.

    Nevertheless, it was possible to find and assess all the records that were present from studies conducted before Seroxat came on the market. Some records were clearly missing and have not been provided since.

    Key studies

    It was clear from this that Seroxat caused agitation in around 25% of takers, that it made things worse when the dose of the drug was increased and problems cleared up when the drug was stopped only to re-emerge when it was restarted.

    According to the usual rules therefore this drug was causing agitation. There had also been a suicide in the program. And Seroxat in one healthy volunteer study was linked with withdrawal effects in around 85% of subjects.

    The Tobin case raised questions about how much of a company’s defense in these SSRI cases depended on ghost-written, or company only authored publications, or how often when there was medical testimony it was based on tabulated figures provided to an expert rather than the raw data.

    In the course of the proceedings, it was not contested that key studies had been terminated early with their results left unpublished.

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  4. Hi Truthman,
    Thanks for all the information.
    Yes the truth has been around for a very long time and ‘The College of Psychiatry of Ireland’ have had the monopoly in the media for far too long. Denying the adverse reactions of these drugs, including suicide, is a tragedy. But the media is changing quickly with the Irish Examiner doing a great job and even the Irish Times seem to be catching on.
    We will wait and see what the Government is going to do about warning Irish people. Professor Healy has been warning about SSRI’s and suicide for years, even going as far as bringing it to the attention of Lundbeck; Shane and our family knew nothing of the possible adverse effects of Cipramil, because Lundbeck chose to ignore it!
    Declan Gilsenan and others are very brave to speak out, considering what the usual response from Irish Psychiatry has been. I suppose you saw what they tried to do to the lovely Michael Corry?
    The truth always come out, lets hope it does before too many more victims die.
    Leonie

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  5. The problem is Leonie, every few years there is a spate of articles in the media drawing attention to the dangers of SSRI’s in relation to suicide, dependence, addiction, side effects etc. This has been happening for decades now. A few journalists make some comments, raise some flags, a few feathers get ruffled, and psychiatry carts out it’s media sound-biters to protect the ideology and repeat the same dogmatic mantra’s. Then it all dies down again, and nothing changes.

    But..

    The difference this time is, we have psychiatrists, GP’s, psychotherapists, coroners and state pathologists coming out all saying the same thing! SSRI’s are dangerous drugs! and these issues need investigating.

    If psychiatry was wise, it would enter into a genuine and sincere dialogue with everyone involved. They would amicably agree to discuss and debate these issues with people like yourself, patient advocates, psychiatric service users, coroners, dissident psychiatrists like David Healy, coroners and state pathologists. Instead, they react as if we are all the enemy and must be defeated, dismissed and ridiculed. This is ridiculous, and also completely counter-productive. It’s divisive, but that it unfortunately where they always bring it to.

    Irish psychiatry has had a god-like strangle hold on the mental health arena for years, it doesn’t want to let that power go easily. It refuses to engage with criticism and comment. It acts as if it has nothing to explain, when quite clearly it has a lot. This stance of denial and defensiveness on behalf of Irish psychiatry serves nobody any good. What we are dealing with here, are people’s lives. People have died because of psychiatric drugs. Psychiatry needs to stop looking at everyone who criticizes it as the enemy, because if it continues along that path it will seriously swing the rope that ultimately will bring the death knell for its ideology.

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  6. Hi Truthman,
    “If psychiatry was wise, it would enter into a genuine and sincere dialogue with everyone involved.”

    How very idealistic of you. I sent an e-mail to the College of Psychiatry of Ireland, querying whether it is still their opinion that it’s ok to prescribe antidepressants for bedwetting. I received this reply back in October and am still waiting for the follow-up. It seems we are not worthy of a reply when we dare to ask questions.

    10/27/11
    Dear Leonie,
    Thank you for your query below which I have passed to our Faculty of Child & Adolescent Psychiatry.
    As I am not a psychiatrist myself I cannot answer your query about bedwetting and antidepressants but I hope to come back to you again soon.
    With Kind Regards
    Andrea

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  7. And yes, I did see what they tried to do with the lovely Michael Corry, god rest him, wonderful man, and fearless to boot. And I have witnessed their arrogance and sinister tactics first hand. They operate on a level of instilling fear and disempowering people.

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  8. Just to come back to the “SSRI’s do not cause suicide” statement. It is widely accepted that SSRI’s cause Akathisia (severe inner turmoil and restlessness). Indeed SSRI’s and anti-psychotics both cause Akathisia. Akathisia has symptoms which include tension, insomnia, a sense of discomfort, motor restlessness, and marked anxiety and panic. I have experienced Akathisia, it is horrific and unbearable, and utterly inhuman.

    This is a description of Akathisia from wikipedia:

    Jack Henry Abbot (1981), a convicted murderer and author, described the effects of akathisia produced by antipsychotic drugs when given without the necessary medication for side effects (e.g. procyclidine) as may occur in prison and even sometimes hospitals:
    These drugs, in this family, do not calm or sedate the nerves. They attack. They attack from so deep inside you, you cannot locate the source of the pain … The muscles of your jawbone go berserk, so that you bite the inside of your mouth and your jaw locks and the pain throbs. For hours every day this will occur. Your spinal column stiffens so that you can hardly move your head or your neck and sometimes your back bends like a bow and you cannot stand up. The pain grinds into your fiber … You ache with restlessness, so you feel you have to walk, to pace. And then as soon as you start pacing, the opposite occurs to you; you must sit and rest. Back and forth, up and down you go in pain you cannot locate, in such wretched anxiety you are overwhelmed, because you cannot get relief even in breathing.
    —Jack Henry Abbot, In the Belly of the Beast (1981/1991). Vintage Books, 35–36. Quoted in Robert Whitaker, Mad in America (2002, ISBN 0-7382-0799-3), 187.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akathisia

    The 2006 UK study by Healy, Herxheimer, and Menkes observed that akathisia is often miscoded in antidepressant clinical trials as “agitation, emotional lability, and hyperkinesis (overactivity)”.[11] The study further points out that misdiagnosis of akathisia as simple motor restlessness occurs, but that this is more properly classed as dyskinesia. Healy, et al., further show links between antidepressant-induced akathisia and violence, including suicide, as akathisia can “exacerbate psychopathology.” The study goes on to state that there is extensive clinical evidence correlating akathisia with SSRI use, showing that approximately ten times as many patients on SSRIs as those on placebos showed symptoms severe enough to drop out of a trial (5.0% compared to 0.5%).

    The turmoil of severe akathisia can lead to suicide and aggression.

    SSRI’s cause Akathisia , Akathisia can induce suicide, therefore, SSRI’s can cause suicide.

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